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V2 you have lost me as a customer!

rukbat1rukbat1 Posts: 9Member
edited October 18 in Customer Service Questions
Well, V2 you finally did it.  I've enjoyed your products enough to suffer thru shipping delays and product delays over the years.  I've always thought your shipping prices were high, but always took them as I could never depend on standard shipping.  Now you are not only charging me a settlement fee, 5 dollars for shipping, but now you want an additional 4.95 for some type of signing fee.  You also had major price increases on the refillable cartridges as well as my e liquids.  I will now be shopping from my local stores as V2 has priced it self out of the market for me. Some day I might come back to purchase the 7x if you ever quit pushing it back.   Bye V2  sorta been good to know you.   @samantha

Comments

  • MajorDouble7MajorDouble7 Posts: 28Member
    Came to the forum looking for this, as I just noticed on my checkout page the same signature fee. Apparently California (my state) is requiring an adult signature? And how is that going to work in my apartment complex of 300 units? The mail carrier delivers to one central mail area, and I'm likely to not be home at the time of delivery anyway. So...really hoping the order I just placed isn't returned when it arrives.

    MD 7
  • rbarron316rbarron316 Posts: 155Member

    @MajorDouble7

    Assume this might be like someone sending you a certified letter that requires a signature.  If they don't get a signature, they leave a card in your box telling you to go to the post office to retrieve the item. 

    On another note, went into system to respond to this.  I use Chrome.  There is no way to get to the forums in Chrome.  Categories in Chrome: 

    Shipping

    Retail & Wholesale

    Batch Testing

    User Manuals

    FAQ

    Blog

    Using Firefox and IE: 

    I copy/pasted, so there is no confusion about what I am seeing.  Different versions for different browsers? 


  • rbaker1009rbaker1009 Posts: 1,268Member
    Came to the forum looking for this, as I just noticed on my checkout page the same signature fee. Apparently California (my state) is requiring an adult signature? And how is that going to work in my apartment complex of 300 units? The mail carrier delivers to one central mail area, and I'm likely to not be home at the time of delivery anyway. So...really hoping the order I just placed isn't returned when it arrives.

    MD 7
    I'm in CA and have never been asked for a signature for my V2 deliveries.
  • Navy20Navy20 Posts: 1,217Member
    I just noticed this on the checkout page . . .
    New York requires the signature so I thought okay I’ll have my orders sent to my daughter in Pennsylvania . . . No guess not . . . Pennsylvania requires the signature also . . .
    Apparently the politicians seem to be one damn step ahead of us !!!!! Unbelievable . . . Or is it ?

    @rbaker1009, apparently this has just recently happened . . . Until now no signature was ever required . . . Could this be a way for the States to monitor online sales and collect sales tax ? Must be a nightmare for V2 !!!!!
  • rbaker1009rbaker1009 Posts: 1,268Member
    Wow @Navy20 this must be recent as my last order was a couple weeks ago. Its going to be a hassle to be present for a signature or pick up at the post office. My guess is that this is not V2's doing but is a State or Federal regulation.

    Unfortunately I'm sure this is just the latest in a steady stream of hassles in store for adults stemming from regulators attempts to keep vaping from minors. And yes, "sin" tax is likely next >:)
  • Navy20Navy20 Posts: 1,217Member
    @rbaker1009, I agree with you . . . I do not believe V2 came up with this “signature fee” but are mandated by State and/or Federal Regulation to collect this fee.
  • rbaker1009rbaker1009 Posts: 1,268Member
    That's great information @rbarron316 and thank you for it. It's time for clarification from V2. They need to get in front of changes that add fee's with communication regardless if this is mandated or not.

    And yes, age verification needs accomplished in a way that doesn't add $4.75 to each purchase, if age verification is even the reason for the new signature requirement. 
     
  • AndiiAndii Posts: 125Member
    Communication is key... you would not upset as many people if you kept them appraised of changes and perhaps a brief reason why.  Even a brief mention on the forums would have been nice.

    @rbarron316 — same is happening in safari web browser on iPad.... no forum clickable. Had to search “v2 forum”.  Hi by the way :)
  • David1886David1886 Posts: 636Member
    I occasionally purchase e-liquid from another USA company that has an Australian website with prices in AUD when I originally created my account they wanted age verification and provided a link to upload.
    I uploaded a copy of my drivers license with the license number covered and was never asked again or charged a fee so V2 should have a system in place after charging the fee for the first time remember that you have been verified and not charge the fee on future orders as that is just more profit for V2 for every order placed.
  • rbarron316rbarron316 Posts: 155Member
    Hi Andii.

    Long time no see B) 

    @David1886, when I read the first few posts here, I thought maybe it was just a California/New York thing.  Then put a test order in my cart (am in Georgia) and it showed the $4.75 charge.  That's when I started looking at what was happening around the country.  Actually, 6 states have raised the tobacco age to 21:  California, NJ, Mass, Oregon, Hawaii, Maine.  350 localities also have done so, including:  NYC, Chicago, San Antonio, Boston, Minneapolis, and both Kansas Cities.

    Tried a test the past few days.  The $4.75 signature fee is not showing any longer, but a coupon code is automatically inserted.  No idea what that's about.

    In any event, sales to minors has always been prohibited.  Problem now is that minors, as relates to tobacco, has been bumped up to age 21.  Using USPS for age 21 attestation won't work because 18-20 years olds can still purchase legally in many states.  Imagine an 18-20 year old legally purchasing something online and then the USPS won't deliver it because the purchaser is under 21.  That's why you don't use the USPS age verification $4.75 method.  They are in the business of getting a signature of a 21 year old, not getting into the tobacco laws of where the delivery is being made.  As you indicate, drivers license would work.  Also, other companies use third-parties that can do age checks.

    They'll get it figured out.  Perhaps this was just a guinea pig moment to see how we'd react. 


  • rukbat1rukbat1 Posts: 9Member
    edited October 23
    FedX only gets a signature, they do not verify age or anything, I just signed for my package, I think anyone in the home could have signed, and really does it cost as much for UPS to get a signature, as it does to send the package.  My company sends signature required packages all the time that need to be signed for and there is no extra charge, and for those of us that work, signing for a day time delivery is almost impossible, logistics should be V2's concern and it should not fall on the backs of their customers. @samantha @rbarron316
  • rbarron316rbarron316 Posts: 155Member

    FYI.  While I understand what you are saying about Fedex signatures, they also have an option for Adult Signature Required, meaning you are either 21 or you aren't getting your package.  Their charge for this is $4.75, the very same that the USPS charges for adult signature.

    Bottom line is online companies who sell tobacco related products have to ensure the purchaser in a number of states and localities is at least 21.  Had the law not changed to 21 in those states/localities, I'm sure this issue wouldn't have come up as most, if not all, primary credit card holders are at least 18. 

    Our posts here are to ask in lieu of charging the customer a signature fee (whether USPS or Fedex or UPS-they charge $5.50 for adult signature), why not just ask for a copy of a drivers license tied into the account name or have a third party do age checks, which I've read are being done by companies.

  • samanthasamantha Posts: 3,553Administrator, Moderator admin
    Hi folks,
    I understand and appreciate your concerns and feedback. The new shipping policy is new and likely temporary as we are aiming to be as strict as possible with our products to make sure they are only consumed by adults over the age of 21 years old. We are very sorry for the inconvenience and are working on an official blog post that will discuss this topic and our stance. Overall, this shipping change will most likely be temporary for most states and if you DM me your order number, I can guarantee you I will take care of you with a pleasing resolution. As many of you may know, we pride ourselves in being the leader of self-regulation and with all the intense scrutiny on the industry, we are going above and beyond in an effort to demonstrate good faith to regulatory bodies. We greatly appreciate everyone's business, time and feedback. And I assure you, if you DM me, I will assist you with a resolution. Thank you for your time. I will post more info once I have it.
  • rbaker1009rbaker1009 Posts: 1,268Member
    Thank you @Samantha. My main concern is to keep vaping supplies accessible so if this is what VMR has to do right now to best protect that I'm ok with it.  
  • rbarron316rbarron316 Posts: 155Member
    Am starting to get a sense of how difficult this might be.  Found a list of the 6 states and all 350 localities where the tobacco age is now 21. 


    Once you pull out the localities from the 6 states (state law would supersede local law), you end up with 6 states and 124 localities (in states that haven't increased the age).  Including all states that have a complete or partial prohibition, you now have 22 states (including D.C.).  So essentially, nearly half the country.  Trust this list will keep growing.

    Trying to base it on a customer's zip code would likely be a nightmare.  There likely are hundreds, if not thousands, of zip codes in those areas.  V2 would need the expertise or purchase the expertise to parse their customer database against the list of zip codes that present a problem.  If they went with a drivers license verification, they would still need to compare that data.  What if the drivers license address didn't match their customer database address.  People change their address, but don't necessarily change their drivers license.  Using a third-party to do age checks might work, but again, people move.  Data on people becomes stale. 

    I guess if even one minor for tobacco purposes (under age 21) is able to purchase something from V2, it would be the equivalent of a minor going into a bar and being able to purchase alcohol.  I'm sure the penalties could potentially be severe, especially if it happens more than just a single time.  The anti-smoking people have a vendetta against all smoking, including vaping.  They're just looking for an "I told you so" moment.

    I think V2 is in a darned if you do and darned if you don't position.  Alienate customers in areas who shouldn't be required to verify age or possibly get caught selling to the new tobacco minors.  Samantha has already come out and stated that she would make things right.  It's not the perfect solution, but it is possibly a stopgap to looking at all angles to find a better solution.

    I'm no V2 cheerleader and have called them out when they were wrong.  In this instance, other than springing it on the customers without any advance notice (to my knowledge), I'm really not sure the best long-term resolution. 



  • GotVapeGotVape Posts: 4Member

    I'm no V2 cheerleader and have called them out when they were wrong.  In this instance, other than springing it on the customers without any advance notice (to my knowledge), I'm really not sure the best long-term resolution. 



    The best long term solution is to take your business to a local shop and help your local community.  V2 has too long of a history doing the wrong thing first.  They can't seem to get their ordering right to keep supply of items in demand, despite them probably knowing lead time on manufacturing and delivery timelines.  This is just piss poor management on them.  They are already alienating customers in states that don't require the verification.  I for one won't ever give them $10 to ship something to me, regardless.  We already wait forever to get things shipped, wait forever for them to get stuff in stock..etc.  The wait for V2 just isn't worth it anymore.  I for one am taking my $70+ in monthly purchases elsewhere.  I have already looked at a comparable replacement to my Series3x.  I suggest you all do the same.  Why give V2 another chance to screw us over.
  • samanthasamantha Posts: 3,553Administrator, Moderator admin
    Hi all - If you have placed an order and would like a pleasant one-time courtesy resolution for the shipping expense, please DM me. I am being told this shipping expense will change within the next 30 days and we encourage you all to stick with us throughout this journey of doing our best to comply with intense self-regulation in an effort to show good faith to federal regulatory bodies. Thank you for your time and patience and I hope you all understand that this is not something we enjoy as we know it puts an additional burden on our loyal, long-term adult customers. 
  • carol44carol44 Posts: 18Member
    edited October 29
    @samantha What information do you require to avoid this ridiculous age verification charge on any future orders? Definitely over age 21 here, by Many years
  • rbarron316rbarron316 Posts: 155Member
    edited October 29

    Plenty of vendors out there who do age verification checks.  One of them says "the only required information for age verification is name, address, and date of birth".  Further, low monthly fees, low transaction rates, no setup fees, and no minimums.

    I trust V2 is looking into one of these vendors, of which there are many.  Charging customers $4.75 every time to ensure sales to 21 year olds is unsustainable.  Will just have to see what they are doing based upon Samantha's comment above that the shipping expenses will change within the next 30 days.

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