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VUSE: Trying to drive out the competition with 4.8% Nicotine!

New_VaperNew_Vaper Posts: 629Member
4.8% seems extremely high.  Does VUSE hope people will get hooked on such a high percentage?

From the VUSE Product FAQ page: 



Tagged:

Comments

  • rbaker1009rbaker1009 Posts: 1,207Member
    edited September 2014

    I find 2.4 a bit high for my taste.

    After looking around a bit it seems 3.6 is about the highest anyone sells. I cant imagine 4.8 yikes

  • mrtmrt Posts: 5,021Member ✭✭✭
    19. How does the nicotine content of the VUSE Digital Vapor Cigarette compare to combustible cigarettes?
    It is important to note that all adult tobacco consumers use tobacco products differently, so comparing the VUSE Digital Vapor Cigarette with a combustible cigarette is not necessarily an accurate comparison. In terms of length of use, generally speaking, one VUSE Cartridge lasts about as long as a pack of combustible cigarettes. In terms of sheer nicotine contained, an unburned combustible cigarette contains 12-17 mg of nicotine, of which about 75-90% is burned, filtered, or diluted out and not consumed by an adult tobacco consumer. VUSE is the first vapor product with a nicotine profile similar to that of a combustible cigarette.

    From that site. Seems high to me, but what do I know. Also other carts will not work with their power unit, proprietary thing.

    jmho
  • New_VaperNew_Vaper Posts: 629Member
    edited September 2014
    Sounds like there is a bit of double talk in their FAQ's.

    My thought and maybe I'm wrong:  Let's say I'm vaping 2.4 carts from V2.  I start using 4.8's from VUSE for awhile.  When I switch back, would a 2.4 really satisfy me?  If I go twice as high, I may need to stay higher because I become dependent on that 4.8% level.

    I guess what it boils down to:  Will 4.8% make me more of an addict and keep me on the VUSE because pretty much nothing else has that high of a percentage?

    In terms of sheer nicotine contained, an unburned combustible cigarette contains 12-17 mg of nicotine, of which about 75-90% is burned, filtered, or diluted out and not consumed by an adult tobacco consumer.  OK

    Nothing is burned when you vape.

    There is no filter when you vape.

    As for "diluted out," that remains a bit of an enigma.

  • mrtmrt Posts: 5,021Member ✭✭✭
    That is what is offered, I could find no other %'s. I use 0% so Vuse does me no good. jmho
  • ColinColin Posts: 203Member
    I finally saw one of there fancy commercials seems like they are a bit late to the party. I guess we'll see.
  • TopweaselTopweasel Posts: 157Member
    I would assume that similarly we exhale a decent portion of nic when we exhale vapor clouds. For people with self control this shouldn't affect anything. You'll vape a similar amount of nic whether its 1.2%, 2.4% or 4.8%. This can go several ways. for lots of people it'll be that vuse will last longer and if they switch back to v2 or similar it'll just more hits. I am sure there'll be some comfort level gained if you vaped Vuse long enough. But I still doubt the overall impact, vapers seem to be a lot more flexible in their habit than smokers. If there does seem to be a huge affect, it will be pretty easy for companies to just start offering more nic in their products. 

    I do wonder as a Tobacco company product, if they are sacrificing Vuse to be a worst case scenario that people can point to during ecig topics to help them get banned. RJR could stand eating a bunch in the brand, if it helps ecigs get banned or over regulated, since it would help keep people on analogs and maintaining sales in their core business. So now someone can point to Vuse as an example of companies upping Nic portions to make it more addictive.
  • CheerMom48CheerMom48 Posts: 28Member
    Or that high nic could make people feel sick. 1.8 gave me headaches when I started. I assumed because I was used to light cigarettes. So now everyone would assume ecigs make them ill and continue smoking.
  • TalonTalon Posts: 251Member ✭✭
    Blu, Vuse.....why oh why would any knowledgeable vaporers support big tobacco??? The only thing that would drive me away from V2 is if they were bought out by a tobacco company so thank god they are independent.
  • Braxton2011Braxton2011 Posts: 12Member
    I agree that it would probably make people sick. When my mother used V2 she went from ultra light analogs to 1.2% menthol. She would take multiple quick puffs and give herself a headache instead of taking her time and letting her body adjust as I suggested to her. I can't imagine a light smoker taking in 3x the nic they are use to and not getting sick.
  • FloridaGalFloridaGal Posts: 122Member
    One "good thing" about Vuse is they say you won't be able to buy them online; you must go to a B&M location. I live in a very rural area and checked my location; right now nearest place for me to buy Vuse is 60 miles away. Fat chance that's gonna happen. I have absolutely no interest in Vuse much less 4.8 nic.
  • KatFreqKatFreq Posts: 496Member
    Its just crazy 4.8. Nics. Its so wrong. All the unsuspecting people that will buy that. Horrible. Really, how dare they!
  • samanthasamantha Posts: 3,357Administrator, Moderator admin
    Wow 4.8 is pretty intense. I believe 1.8% is our most sold nic strength. And @new_vaper is right... burning & filter with an ecig? Not making much sense. 

    And @Topweasel you have a valid yet scary point. Smart yet very deceitful if becomes true in the long-run. Well at least you all know that V2 was started and still owned by some young (30's) Miami entrepreneurs that are very vested in the company.
  • RockoRocko Posts: 184Member
    I don't understand the focus on nicotine and feel that is is generations of misinformation. All if us who switched went through withdrawal. Most of us can go way longer between vapes if we have to and we're not miserable to others like we were when we smoked. Big tobacco and government have always preached nicotine is bad for you while trying to sweep the other chemicals under the rug of the public eye. Why? I'm sure they have the answers but act ignorant to avoid public back lash.

    We crave what we were addicted to. We want that feeling, taste and sight that smoking gave us. Addiction is psychological as well as physical. We got through the physical side and are here now. I know that even with zero nic, I have to taste and see something when I breathe out. I feel nicotine is less addictive than caffeine since switching and experimenting with the levels.

    In a few years we will have different info on vaping and nicotine content. We will have the time to gain more knowledge and make better choices. We have a lot of misinformation to deal with now so it will take time.
  • ColinColin Posts: 203Member
    I wouldn't be surprised if a company like Vuse would make an electronic cigarette which is potentially harmful to the public in order to give a black eye to the entire industry. Intentionally forcing the hand of government to increase regulations and restrictions in order to drive up cost and limit access, forcing people back to conventional cigarettes. These companies are ruthless and there is slot of money at stake here.
  • TalonTalon Posts: 251Member ✭✭
    4.8 is irresponsible for ANY company to offer. You would have to have a very high tolerance to not have OD symptoms from going that high. I know that nicotine OD is not usually life threatening (unless it is swallowed in high concentration) but there are documented side effects from getting to much nic. at one time. Scary thought for an ignorant person that selects that as their first venure into ecigs. Personally I wouldn't go higher than 2.4 but I know that 3.6 is being found more common with companies.
  • fistyfisty Posts: 254Member
    I couldn't even suck in 4.8. Good lord I've smoked for 20+ years and only in the last 5 months or so I can forget my vaporizer, go to town and back home and not even realize it. My biggest prob is people needing a lighter and looking to me, and I'm all I don't have one after a life time of always having one for sure!
    I started out 2.4 with v2 now I realized I was getting sick and throat hurt vaping. Dropped down to 1.2 or even .6 or .8 is great. But the lies will be told how ecigs don't help,, ask my Dr. !!

    Caffeine will make me nervous and shakey more so than nicotine but ya don't hear about that.
  • desertkatdesertkat Posts: 1,343Member
    That would knock me under the table...
  • jellytoastjellytoast Posts: 421Member
    edited September 2014
    My husband had to take my car in to be worked on today. It's about an hour away from here and was going to take half the day for the repairs, so he was walking around all day looking for things to do. I told him about a vape shop in the area and he decided to go check it out. He texts me and says it's overwhelming. Then he calls and tells me about the hundreds of bottles of juice that they have there. Then goes on to say that the shop guy told him that some of their juices go all the way up to 8%. 8% !?!?! That's freakin high!!! He uses 2.4% right now, the shop guy told him that an analog is 10% and vaping isn't satisfying him because he's using such a low level of nic. So now he's all excited about this 8% and wanted to get some but I told him no, not right now. This is why he doesn't get to go out on public alone!! [-( How much would 8% be anyway? If 2.4% is 24 mg does that mean 8% is 80 mg?? Makes my tummy turn thinking about it  :-&
  • KatFreqKatFreq Posts: 496Member
    @jellytoast‌ you are right, do not let that man go wandering around by himself. Good things will not come of it. You need to leash him. That is crazy! [-X
  • jellytoastjellytoast Posts: 421Member
    lol @KatFreq, he needs a short leash. :P

    @BanillaBob‌ I'm not going anywhere near that vape shop, I'll stick to what I know and trust. He said he's stopping by after work some time to get some juices. He's stubborn, wouldn't listen when I said it wasn't a good idea. The guy works there and everything he said makes sense so it has to be true, right?? 8-|
  • jellytoastjellytoast Posts: 421Member
    He still smokes at work @BanillaBob‌, but at least he's giving vaping a try. He expects the big nic rush and head rush he gets from analogs and he's not getting it from vaping, so he thinks he's not getting nicotine. I never asked him to quit. He saw me vaping in the house and liked the idea of not having to go outside at night to smoke. I don't have to smell analogs at home anymore so I'm happy. I gave him some of my EX blanks and juices (which are 1.2 and 1.8) and says he likes them but they're too low. He usually uses 2.4 carts. If he does try the super high nic juices I want to see the look on his face lol If it works for him that's great, he knows where to stop on the way home from work to pick some up now.
  • fhaughfhaugh Posts: 21Member
    I got some coupons in the mail for free vuse and carts so I picked them up just to give them a try.  Maybe leave them in the van "for emergency use only."  I used to roll my own cigarettes (3 mo. ago) and smoked a pack a day, so I'm used to high nicotine content.  The vuse is strong, but I don't think it's as strong as they claim.  I never got a head rush or nausea and I was puffing on that thing for half the day.  I don't think that the actual vapor from the vuse contains 4 times the nicotine that the same amount of vapor from a 1.2% liquid does.  I tore apart that vuse cartridge after I was done with it and I was surprised to find that, not only was the filler material a lot smaller and thinner than in other cartomizers, but it was still very moist with fluid.  I would have vaped a normal carto dry but that vuse still had juice left.  The fluid may be 4.8%, but I didn't get 4 times the nicotine into my system.
    One thing to remember is that regular nicotine user will stop their intake when their nicotine level hit the level that feels right.  How many smokers will put out a cigarette half way because they are "done."  I don't think that many people will have OD issues with any inhaled nicotine system.

    Having said all that, I can say that the vuse SUCKS ROTTEN!  It is too strong for the average person, taste like ass, and at $3 a cartridge (less than one day for me) I wouldn't even be saving any money on them.  I used to spend about $1 a day on tobacco and rolling tubes, so they would actually cost me MORE!
    I don't think that RJR is trying to give e-cigs a black eye.  I think they are trying to catch the customers that haven't found the instant fix they want in other e-cigs.  The fact that their batteries and carts only work for each other keeps those same customers coming back because they don't want to have to find a whole new system that works for them.  I also think that they have invested so much in developing their brand that they have a vested interest in keeping e-cigs legal.  What will benefit them is banning of flavors (except ass flavored), and requiring FDA testing since they have the budget to make that happen.

    BTW, the vuse I got for free was a "proof of concept" for me.  I went almost all day without lighting up, so I knew I could do it.  After fooling around with one of the e-go styles for a few days, I tried a friend's V2 and went out to a gas station that night to pick up my basic starter.  I couldn't be happier with my V2 experience.
  • fhaughfhaugh Posts: 21Member
    I just realized something.  With the amount of juice that was left in that "used up" vuse cartridge, all someone would have to do to keep using it would be to reset the little computer chip inside.  That puts a whole new spin on their "cartridge recycling program".  A quick wipe with a sterilizing agent to clean off the users germs, plug it into the computer to reset, and send it back out to the next sucker!
  • fhaughfhaugh Posts: 21Member
    @BanillaBob,  Actually, $15 for cartridges that last 2-3 months, and $5-10 dollars a week on juice equals out to less than $1 a day.  And I'm not spending and hour or more rolling everyday.  I was saying that the vuse cartridges were going to cost me more.  I've actually been saving money since I quit.  My health insurance doesn't ask if you smoke so that doesn't matter, but I've been thrilled with how much my health has improved already.  No more hacking up a lung 3 times a day.  I've also notice what all the non-smokers have been bitching about all these years.  People who smoke smell disgusting!  As far as nicotine goes, I don't ever plan on giving it up.  I've quit smoking for years before, and it doesn't work well with my ADHD.  I'm happier with my life with nicotine in it, and even if multiple studies come back contradicting the 2 year study that was already done, I don't think I'll be quitting.  That's why I love V2's so much.  I can have my nic fix without the cancer.
  • SirVapeALotSirVapeALot Posts: 321Member
    LOL it's true about the smell @fhaugh I actually went out and bought new clothes because I couldn't stand the stink of my own clean clothes!
  • ColinColin Posts: 203Member
    Never rolled my own but I'm saving about 100$ per month probably a little bit more, and I feel way better. 50 bucks a month compared to 150$. Took me a little while but I actually enjoy all the flavors now too. I urge people to go back and try v2 flavors they didn't like the first time around and they will be surprised.
  • KatFreqKatFreq Posts: 496Member
    @Colin‌, you are so right! My taste is constantly changing. My one time faves turn into flavors I don't even want to look at for awhile. Recently I retried 2 old favorites, that I did not want for the last recent months, menthol, and grape. Its like rediscovering a new favorite all over again. So yes, definitely retry what you did not care for. It may become your new favorite.
  • dikirk53dikirk53 Posts: 1Member
    I tried Vuse and I thought it was good.  I had a coupon for a free trial kit.  Anyway I've been with V2 for over a year and I've always been happy with their products.  Although lately, I seem to be going through more cartridges than usual.  The flavor goes down faster.  Not sure why.
  • Eric95MEric95M Posts: 60Member
    I started with 2.4% thinking I needed all I could get.  I was like GEEZ this is strong.  8%?  someone is nuts.  My goal is to continually drop nic levels (am in no hurry as I am a non smoker now).  I will get to 0% and still vape.  I enjoy it and have no plans on stopping....
  • estockme84estockme84 Posts: 4Member
    Njoy kings are 4.5% nicotine. https://www.njoy.com/faq
  • supremecsupremec Posts: 108Member
    Its not a surprise that a tobacco company wants people to remain addicted to nicotine. Even the NRT industry managed to get the FDA to remove the requirement that smoking cessation products carry a strict limit on how long they can be used. So, now thay can keep people hooked on their patches, lozenges and gum.

    Say hello to heart disease 4.8% Vuse users!

    ....
  • supremecsupremec Posts: 108Member
    Or that high nic could make people feel sick. 1.8 gave me headaches when I started. I assumed because I was used to light cigarettes. So now everyone would assume ecigs make them ill and continue smoking.
    I also smoked "lights" [ultras] and when I started vaping I was using 1.2% and would feel light-headed after several puffs. 0.6% is more than enough for me.

    ...
  • DK_X6DK_X6 Posts: 1Member

    I know this is a bit old but,

    @samantha and @ new_vaper, they are talking about actual cigarettes with the "burned, filtered or diluted out" piece.

    In terms of sheer nicotine contained, an unburned combustible cigarette contains 12-17 mg of nicotine, of which about 75-90% is burned, filtered, or diluted out and not consumed by an adult tobacco consumer.

    So your looking at (using their figures) between 1.5-4.25mg actually "consumed" by a smoker.

    The Vuse is certainly high, I used mine if I needed to when charging.  Got coupons for a free one and a pack of carts.  Seems to work relatively well, taste is well...not so good.  won't be buying carts for it.

    DK

  • SirSmokemSirSmokem Posts: 75Member ✭✭
    supremec said:
    I also smoked "lights" [ultras]image and when I started vaping I was using 1.2% and would feel light-headed after several puffs. 0.6% is more than enough for me.
    ...
    The thing that gets me is how much electronic cigarettes are marketed as the 'quit-smoking' tool, but yet companies are still pushing them with more and more nico. Of course it's still better vaped than from a cig (due to the filters used) but you have to consider that it is a business and these companies don't want you to stop smoking or anything else that's good for your health, they want you to keep at it so you can have more problems so they can treat more issues so you can spend more money so they can make more money. At least with electronic cigarettes, with custom modding/batteries/voltage/ etc. you can completely control what goes in/out and not have to worry about all these extra issues.
  • murph99murph99 Posts: 239Member
    The vuse tases like crap anyway...but 4.8+??  Good grief...might as well buy a quart and take shots!
  • BostonJRBostonJR Posts: 1Member
    I like the idea of Vuse! They make them with high nicotine (And whatever else is in them) so that It feels and gives you the sensation of a REAL cigarette. SO far NO e-liquid I have tried gives me the same feeling as a Real cigarette. It makes me think that I'm addicted to the other chemicals that are in the real tobacco cigarettes. I dont care who makes the vapor devices and who makes sthe vapor liquid. As long as I can quit smoking tobacco, because its killing me literally. Im a new vaporer and I just want to save money and save my life span. Vuse and V2 are making moeny off of us. They are not paying my bills. All I want is serious Quality. If RJR is the only one that can replicate a cig then im going with them. So what If they are a big company. All i care about is getting my health back. just my opion and feelings about the whole small business crap. All of the time I take a drag of a 2.4 (Nicotine) of the small companies liquid, and i still do not feel the same sensation there is in a real cig. Im still having trouble quiting cigs. Im still waiting fr the perfect e-liquid. I wish Vuse made e-Liquid because aparently they seem to have the only liquid that is similar to a real cig.
  • supremecsupremec Posts: 108Member
    SirSmokem said:



    The thing that gets me is how much electronic cigarettes are marketed as the 'quit-smoking' tool, but yet companies are still pushing them with more and more nico.

    Any e-cig manufacturer pushing products that contain high percentages of nicotine just want you hooked on the nicotine -- as do the NRT companies.
  • mrtmrt Posts: 5,021Member ✭✭✭
    They are not marketed as " 'quit-smoking' tool(s)". That would make them medical devices and subject to very stringent regulation. jmho
  • supremecsupremec Posts: 108Member
    That may be true. However, the FDA changed the rules regarding NRT's. In the past, NRT product labels stated the user should stop using the nicotine replacement product after 12 weeks at most, and that the user should stop smoking or using other products containing nicotine when they begin using the nicotine replacement product. Since 2013, that is no longer the case.

    Where smoking is concerned, the dependency on cigarettes is due in large part to the nicotine. Higher doses of nicotine or longer indefinite use of an NRT product only further facilities that dependency and that makes billions for the e-cig and NRT industries.
  • daytripperdaytripper Posts: 392Member
    @BostonJR, You do have another option to vape your own own juices with a much higher nicotine level. Visit your local vape shop that has a DIY Center and purchase a bottle of USP Nicotine and add it to your favorite flavored juice. 

    A little instructional research and purchase of a few pieces of inexpensive safety apparel would be highly recommended before starting. If you really want to get with it and save a ton of money, mix your own juice from scratch for about $.08 per ml. and have control over reducing your nic level as needed. Vuse doesn't give you that option and most likely won't anytime soon as they get the FDA to ban open systems! Can you say " Vapeshiner!"

    Last but not least, nicotine is absorbed by the body at a much lesser rate while vaping versus smoking, therefore you do end up vaping a bit more to get  the same nic level as smoking. And lets not forget about  the 4000 other chemicals, some of which are added to make your body absorb the nicotine much faster, such as ammonia!  Best wishes on your journey! :-\"
  • Andries_V2cigsAndries_V2cigs Posts: 680Administrator admin
    edited February 2015
    A few thoughts on the topic of 4.8%...

    2 puffs at 4.8% nicotine, will deliver the same nicotine to the user as 4 puffs at 2.4% nicotine 

    the higher the percentage of nicotine in a puff the harsher the product could taste
     
    at 2.4% nicotine it is much easier to make the flavor profile come through strongly... many of the flavorings can be masked with 4.8% nicotine, making more subtle light flavors like "Pina Colada, or Cherry very hard to bring through to the human palette.

    Part of the joy of Vaping is the process of puffing, exhaling and the oral fixation of bringing the device to the mouth... at 4.8% you cant take as many puffs, because it would likely give you a headache, so you would have to puff far less frequently

    The VUSE cartridge actually gives you not much more total nicotine weight than a comparable V2 cartridge... note that their carts are filled with about 0.5ml of liquid, and a V2 classic cart is filled with over 0.9ml of liquid... so with a VUSE cart at 4.8% nicotine you would be getting 0.024ml of nicotine in the entire cartridge, and with a V2 cart at 2.4% you would be getting 0.022ml of nicotine in the entire cartridge. By reducing the amount of liquid in each cartridge and increasing the nicotine percentage of said liquid, Reynolds is attempting to mitigate future tax concerns, because many states are considering implementing ecig taxes based on the amount of gross eliquid weight in a cartridge. If they can pay 1/2 the tax for every cartridge sold, they make more margin.
  • gpro22gpro22 Posts: 16Member
    I started vaping about a month ago to see if it would help me quit smoking, and started with the Vuse menthol. It had a pretty strong throat hit, but I think it made me sick. I threw up for 2 days and at first just thought it was food poisoning. I then read that the nicotine content was 4.8 and started looking for an alternative. That's when I found the V2 pro. I now use 1.8% liquid and it's perfect. No nausea at all! Other problems with Vuse aside from the extremely high content; 1. tastes burnt, 2. cartridges don't last very long' 3. Made by big tobacco, and from what I have read, they are trying to do away with refillable cartridges. In short, I am not sure I could have quit smoking with Vuse, but now that I found the V2 pro, I am very confident I will not go back to regular cigs.
  • murph99murph99 Posts: 239Member
    Could also make an 8% or 10% and just shoot it! Come on...the nic is still toxic you know.
  • kt5280kt5280 Posts: 214Member
    Or just order the nicotine extract and drink it straight out of the bottle. Yucky!
  • devito77devito77 Posts: 4Member
    How would nicotine salt ejuice be in the series 3x pro? Has anyone tried it and would recommend it? Or does it just gunk up the coils and start tasting like crap?
  • LunaMothLunaMoth Posts: 5Member
    I have used VUSE quite a bit.  Used it before I switched to V2 and occasionally use it if I run out of V2 stuff and haven't received a shipment yet.  

    Even though VUSE has a 4.8% nicotine level, their batteries are honestly really crappy.  Not powerful at all.  I use 2.4% from V2 and get a better hit using the Classic and EX batteries than I ever have from VUSE.  I suspect that VUSE jacks up the nic level because of how awful their batteries  are.  

    If I were to compare the batteries...

    V2
    I have bought a total of four batteries from V2.  The first two were in the Classic starter kit and the second two were from the EX starter kit.  Have had the Classic batteries for about a year and a half and the EX batteries for about six month.  Almost never use the Classics anymore, but they still work well even after all this time.  The EX batteries are slightly stronger in power from what I have noticed, but they are otherwise fairly similar.  I typically go through two batteries a day so they get charged once a day.  

    VUSE
    I don't even know how many batteries I have bought from them.  They do not last very long at all and some barely work from the start.  I've had a bunch leak out of nowhere after only a handful of uses.  Considering how much less I use VUSE than V2, I consider VUSE to be absolutely abysmal in quality.  The ONLY reason why I sometimes buy VUSE is because of the convenience factor (and some of the flavours are good, namely Melon, Nectar, and Chai).

    If V2 had a 4.8% nic level, it would absolutely be way too strong and sickening to use, but that's because the V2 batteries are excellent.  VUSE needs to up their nic level to an absurd degree just because their product is crap.  
  • chows1965chows1965 Posts: 7Member
    Vuse sucks!
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